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  • I cancelled my Flight Simulator pre-order!

    How's that for a click-bait title?

    Here's what I really did, and what I want your thoughts on:
    I had expressed concern previously about pre-ordering through the Microsoft Store... it just didn't feel 'right'. After seeing that it became available shortly thereafter on Steam, I had been haunted daily by the thought that I was making a mistake leaving my pre-order on the Microsoft Store. Now, probably 24 hours prior to actually having my credit card 'pinged' for the pre-order from Microsoft, I cancelled the order, and will be purchasing the pre-order through Steam instead.
    - I don't own (and probably never will) an Xbox.
    - I want to be able to see/manipulate/modify the file/folder contents/structure of the program.
    - I don't want to have a horror story like the ones I've read about with regards to the Microsoft Store.

    ... Did I do the right thing?
    Take the time, a second to soar; for soon after, beckons a second more.

  • #2
    My personal thought is yes. BUT... I do wonder if sales through MS (including however they sell add-ons) would help spur additional development, so it is ongoing kind of like Windows 10, with new features and bug fixes being released continuously. A one and done purchase is impossible to justify that ongoing expense. So how do we make sure MS/Asobo has enough revenue stream to keep going.

    If it's worth keeping at all.

    (ED has kept going though despite being on Steam, but I have seen those calls to buy direct from Frontier for the same financial reasons...)
    - Michael
    Check out my cockpit build!

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    • #3
      You did get my attention, Wingman. My comments here will also be referred to in Karl's poll thread as I never posted in that thread. I'm going with Steam Premium FSXX on launch day. What follows is my reasoning.

      I never pre-ordered. There was no benefit besides possibly avoiding the release day download jam. The beta testers were not offered any additional discounts nor perks, whether pre-ordering or not. When first announced, Steam wasn't even an option to consider.

      My simming situation is that I have two houses in Las Vegas, each with gigabit internet and desktop gaming rigs in various degrees of FSXX capability. My most powerful system, currently running the beta 1.6.13 at Ultra and High settings, 3K (sometimes 4K on a TV set), 30 to 35 fps has my best FCS (aged Thrustmaster Warthog hotas and Saitek pedals) and is located at "the old house" where I primarily reside. The old "BigBox" community server desktop has been repurposed as my son's principle office computer in his office at the old house. BigBox currently has no FCS attached but I have lots of spare working FCS parts that could be plugged in. My previous desktop is located at the new house. It is still adequate for FSXX with a proper CPU, Nvidia 1080 and SSD's and has my old F.L.Y 5 one piece FCS attached (worst hardware advice you've ever given me, Wingman.) Altho my son and granddaughter have an Xbox One at the old house, there is no current need nor desire to purchase a new Xbox X. There is household lobbying for a second, higher resolution VR headset along with the current Oculus Rift.

      With a Steam purchase of FSXX, I can play at any of these locations (of course not concurrently) that may be applicable. With a stand alone license I would be limited to my primary rig at the old house. I will at least load up the Steam FSXX files at both houses and probably on BigBox and my granddaughter's i7 CPU, Nvidea 1070 laptop. Maybe Sarah will like the F.L.Y. 5.
      Respects, Bob ...

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      • #4
        As long as you make us a flight to all the runways in Alaska like you did in Flight....then you did the right thing
        http://www.msflights.net/pilots/phpv...es/MSF0027.png

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        • #5
          The points you listed are plenty good reasons to avoid the Microsoft Store. The issues I've had with games and other "apps" from the Microsoft and Xbox on PC store were not easily diagnosed or fixed and seemed completely nonsensical. I've been using Steam since 2004 and I'm struggling to think of any major problems I've had with Steam client itself. It's usually a problem with the game and not Steam, or the inevitable unexpected server downtime or other back end issues.

          Steam does take a large cut of the profits Microsoft would see, they take 30% on the first $10,000,000 in revenue and then it switches to 75/25, and then 80/20 after $50,000,000. That's overall revenue including DLC not just sales. Of course its possible Microsoft negotiated their own deal but I'm just going by the numbers Valve put out. If the Microsoft Store and Xbox Apps were better I wouldn't have an issue supporting them directly but little has improved in the last 2 years or so that Ive been using their service so if they give me the option to buy it on Steam, I'm going to buy it on Steam.
          Facebook: www.facebook.com/msflights
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          • #6
            In regards to my reasons for buying Steam FSXX instead of Microsoft Store:

            The sim settings, specifically the FCS button bindings and such, are stored in the cloud for FSXX, unlike the local computer storage in FSX. I have posed this question of using one Steam license on multiple computers in the testers' forum and I awaite comments and answers there. This cloud settings storage may negate my reasoning for buying Steam. I really WOULD rather Asobo-Microsoft got all of my purchase dollars.
            Respects, Bob ...

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by ROBERT DUNN 2 View Post
              In regards to my reasons for buying Steam FSXX instead of Microsoft Store:

              The sim settings, specifically the FCS button bindings and such, are stored in the cloud for FSXX, unlike the local computer storage in FSX. I have posed this question of using one Steam license on multiple computers in the testers' forum and I awaite comments and answers there. This cloud settings storage may negate my reasoning for buying Steam. I really WOULD rather Asobo-Microsoft got all of my purchase dollars.
              If those bindings are stored in Microsoft Cloud or whatever it is, then you should be fine. You will have to sign into your Microsoft account on the Steam version of FSXX and your account data will be the same on the Steam version as it is on non-Steam versions. I played Halo on Xbox PC app via Gamepass and later purchased it on Steam. When I launched Halo on Steam, I logged into my Microsoft account and it downloaded my save data. So whatever data that was tied to my save data carried over, but things like my graphics settings did not. So if right now, if you can log into multiple computers in the beta and your data and FSC bindings are carrying over, that shouldn't change if you decide to get the Steam version.

              Even with a standalone license I'm pretty sure you would be able to login to your Microsoft account and download a copy for each PC you have, provided that when FSXX is in use you are signed into your account and not a secondary one. I might be wrong though, I've never tried it myself.

              Steam also has Family Sharing, you can share your Steam library with 5 other accounts and can be used on up to 10 devices. I'm not sure if titles like FSXX would support a feature like that though given that you will still require the Microsoft account login.
              Facebook: www.facebook.com/msflights
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              http://steamcommunity.com/groups/msflights
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              • #8
                Thanks, ak. Can you still view staff postings ak ? I have a subject I'd like to discuss with those who currently frequent these latest topics (but not publicly) and I know some staff cannot read staff forum posts since vBulletin version 5 was implemented. Kalo can fix individual member staff forum access but Kalo says he must do it case-by-case.

                From your advice in your post # 7 above, I believe I'll go with the Steam FSXX option. Again, I'd chance a Microsoft Store purchase as my preferred alternative if I can run one license on multiple computers. A tester commenter also replied to my question here and indicated that a controls profile change would be all that I needed to do to run single license Steam FSXX on several computers. Your detailed counsel covers much more and is more helpful, tho. Thanks a bunch.
                Respects, Bob ...

                Comment


                • #9
                  You are quite welcome Robert, glad I could help! I hope you can find a solution that works well for you that doesn't require much tinkering.

                  I haven't been staff for 4 years now, so no I do not have access to any of the staff forums. You are more then welcome to shoot me a private message here on the forums or on Steam.
                  Facebook: www.facebook.com/msflights
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                  • #10
                    GamingBolt put out a YouTube video entitled "Microsoft Flight Simulator - 15 Things You NEED TO KNOW BEFORE YOU BUY" on July 30th. In it, at timestamp 8:35, narrator discussed add-on partnership program. Narrator stated, among other content partner requirements, ""content on the marketplace can't be sold anywhere else".

                    Has anybody heard any clarifying statements about this exclusivity ? Will this mean that add-ons that are sold on the marketplace can not be installed in a Steam licensed installation ? Anything else about this exclusivity requirement that I don't know enough to ask about ?

                    Unavalibility of future add-ons available on Microsoft marketplace to a Steam license would alter my inclination to purchase FSXX thru Steam.

                    If I did this correctly, jump to timestamp 8:35 of the cited video below, a few seconds before "Marketplace for Mods" chapter, which runs for about 30 seconds.



                    Thanks in advance for counsel.
                    Respects, Bob ...

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      From the briefing we received from Microsoft and Asobo, there is no requirement to sell content via the Microsoft store. They would prefer it, but it is not required. All content must comply with the SDK standards, but is not required to be on the store.
                      So not sure where this is coming from. My understanding from the same briefing would be that DLC purchased via either Steam or Microsoft store links the purchase to your Microsoft ID and unlocks insim to download. (much like how Flight did it). How non store partners do it remains to be seen, however from my exploration it would be easy to have a manifest deploy files and add them in a way very similar to P3Ds way of using AddOn method.
                      Per Ardua Ad Astra

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                      • #12
                        I thought, with my limited time to watch these videos/read articles, that there will be an in-game/sim store, and that in-game/sim store would then therefore be the 'marketplace' to which the video refers at 8:50 "...content on the marketplace can't be sold anywhere else." If my thoughts are correct, I then draw the following assumptions/conclusions... assclusions, if you will:

                        0a. BOTH platforms (MS-Store & Steam) will launch/run the exact same Microsoft Flight Simulator software.
                        0b. BOTH platforms' versions of the software will therefore have the same in-game/sim marketplace.
                        1. SOME add-on content will be available in the in-game/sim marketplace.
                        2. THAT content cannot then also be sold anywhere else i.e. Microsoft Store, Steam, Direct-from-the-content-creator
                        3. SINCE that content is being purchased in-game/sim, it has got be usable in-game/sim, regardless of launcher/platform.
                        4. OTHER add-on content will be sold via the MS-Store, Steam, or direct-from-the-content-creator.

                        What the above assumptions leave unaddressed is whether or not content purchased via the above-suggested routes of MS-Store, Steam, or Direct-from-creator will be installable/accessible regardless of the platform through which you purchased MSFS (MS-Store or Steam). Nova's comment suggests that such content will be usable, regardless of platform.

                        If my initial thoughts above are not correct, then... well... nevermind! )
                        Last edited by Wingman; August 7, 2020, 12:53 PM. Reason: Added more assclusions.
                        Take the time, a second to soar; for soon after, beckons a second more.

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                        • #13
                          Nova is correct

                          "Becoming a partner doesn’t alter your ability to sell your content on your own websites and storefronts. Just like with FSX, you can continue to sell your content outside of our Marketplace. Becoming a Microsoft Flight Simulator Marketplace Partner essentially unlocks another channel for you."



                          They are also careful to say "your own websites and storefronts", so I guess there is the potential that if you want to sell your product in the FSXX marketplace, you cannot then also sell it in a third party storefront (like Orbx selling their products via FSS).This would still allow developers like Aerosoft to sell their products in the marketplace and their own storefront.
                          Facebook: www.facebook.com/msflights
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                          http://steamcommunity.com/groups/msflights
                          YouTube Channel: http://www.youtube.com/user/MSFlightsMedia


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                          • #14
                            Yeah, that video is just wrong from the other things that have been said.

                            I would argue though that many developers only use 3rd party storefronts, such as SimMarket for FSUIPC. Those sites then become the storefronts for developers.

                            Some things may depend on existing agreements though. And many developers may find better market penetration by being part of the MS store, although they may make less per sale.
                            - Michael
                            Check out my cockpit build!

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                            • #15
                              Regarding my post # 3 and subsequent discussion in this thread pursuant to single FSXX license being playable on multiple computers:

                              I asked on tester forum, in part:

                              Will a single license purchase from Microsoft Store enable the same access from these two separate computers ?

                              An obviously knowledgeable tester answered me:

                              Any application from the Microsoft store can be installed on up to 10 devices (any device that has the MS store, including Xbox, Hololens, etc.), as long as the device supports that application. You need to be logged in to the same Microsoft/Xbox live account on all the devices, of course. You can see your app store device limits here: https://account.microsoft.com/devices/content

                              Mind you, this does not mean that you can share the license between family members, as all the installations need to be signed in to the same Xbox live account.

                              And as @TheUnseenCat mentioned, MSFS is not a pure UWP application. It is just a packaged store app. I have looked at the app manifest of the release version, and it looks like it is not using any of the virtual registry/file system that UWP applications typically use.

                              Still, there are some potential benefits of getting the store version. The core binary is protected with proper access controls, so it provides more security and integrity to the application. You also get an “almost” clean uninstall.

                              Don’t worry, even though the binary is protected, the sim’s contents are not locked away from you. They reside in AppData, so you as the user have complete control over the files in AppData.

                              P. S.: I say not a pure UWP, as the definition of UWP apps have changed a lot over the years, and still changing.

                              Another tester answered:

                              Microsoft store does allow for up to 5 family members to share titles. If a different account is part of your family group, they can have access to your purchases and play at the same time. Its similar to the xbox model.

                              My entire tester forum question read:

                              I would prefer to transfer the greater portion of my purchase to Microsoft-Asobo. However, I believe from recent research here in forum and elsewhere that the single Steam edition MSFS2020 license will be accessible from my two different computers at two different houses that I occupy under the same Microsoft Windows log-in account and the same Steam account. My Steam Edition FSX enables me to run its single license on these two separate computers.

                              Will ONLY the Steam Edition MSFS2020 enable a single license run under a single Steam account on a single Windows 10 log-in to be accessible on two separate computers ? (Of course, NOT at the same time.) Will a single license purchase from Microsoft Store enable the same access from these two separate computers ?

                              I am purchasing on launch day from Steam with this two computer access as my main deciding factor. Thanks in advance for opinions. Prior counsel provided to me from Steam knowledgeable experts available in this thread upon request.

                              Respects, Bob ...

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